The Wall Street Journal/Scott
McCartney, 11/11/15. "New routes mean more noise for some homes near
airports. Revised flight paths have airplanes saving time and fuel on
arrival and departure-- and residents fuming at the FAA."
 |
| "NextGen" satellite navigation works... to drive some people nuts. |
.... FAA says it has
launched a 20-city survey of noise tolerance to see if its longtime
noise-impact standard is still valid. The threshold, called 65 DNL, defines
acceptable noise impact as day-night levels below an average of 65 decibels
over 24 hours, weighted to count nighttime noise more heavily. Over the past
two decades, airplanes have gotten much quieter. But residents may have also
grown more sensitive. ....The
noise has 'ruined our peace,' Ms. McAuliffe (resident of Los Gatos) says, 'The
FAA says there was no significant impact and I don’t know how they could think
that.' " Read article.
Submitted by Jim Wagner
56 comments:
I know Fred Howard and a group of citizens in the back of Linda Mar Valley sued the airport. This was back in the 1980's.
The airport wasn't sued. The city has an airport noise abatement committee of which I was a member. Back in the day, the airport would listen to local concerns and adjust accordingly. Congress has since passed bills essentially telling the FAA that it doesn't have to pay any attention to those on the ground. Only pressure on our congressional representatives will have an effect. Eshoo has introduced a couple of bills addressing this and Speier's office is very involved. Those of us affected live with this constant noise.
So why did the airport pay for sound proofing. New windows and doors for houses? Was it cause they are just really nice and generous?
Perhaps complaints were more effective and officials more concerned. That was then and this is now. Airports probably connived and manuveured to get regs and oversight changed and friends well placed so they can now claim there's no problem. Damn bureaucrats!
So if you buy a house around the airport, that was clearly there first, then you complain about airport noise, that is a form of Nimbyism.
Have you heard those big waves crashing lately at Linda Mar? The noise is way beyond anything tolerable, bordering on deafening. And it goes on all night! Something has to be done. There must be someone we can complain to about the ocean. The fact that I was here first must count for something.
1131 Bless your heart. We prefer not to see it that way because then we would be hypocrites and make entirely credible the idea that with the right motivation, such as personal interest or gain, any one of us can be a NIMBY. You see? We are not so different one from the other.
Not to worry, Councilmember Sue Digre has been working on this challenge for two years. No progress report, well?
110, no one lives on Linda Mar Beach, do they? Do you?
Wrong:
SFO agreed to a noise abatement and specific flight paths decades ago.
Countermanding the agreement, especially without notice or debate, makes them "bad will" actors. In this case it is not Nimbyism since thousands of people have bought homes with an understanding of the flight paths and noise corridor already in place.
I personally would not buy a home in a noisy flight path. To have it sprung on me 30 years later is unacceptable.
If Digre and Keener can take a break from their social engineering experiments and do something about this social injustice that is ruining the life quality for thousands of people in Pacifica, it would be greatly appreciated.
110 Sounds like a problem for our cracker-jack City Council.
240 Jeezlaweez. You're a nimby AND stuck in a time-warp. It's like one of the other local nimbies expecting a decades old highway to handle today's traffic 'cause when he bought his house no one told him Pacifica might change. A victim of bad faith dealing? Nah, he's got denial and self-interest. Cornerstones of NIMBYISM. Given the world we live in, worry less about property value and just be glad the planes stay in the air.
The flight path was changed to save fuel costs. Planes used to fly out over the ocean to turn left and go south. Now they turn over land and fly south right over Pacifica. All those people in Linda Mar now hear airplane noise many times an hour, from early morning to late at night. They didn't hear it before because the planes weren't there. The people in their homes really were here first. They didn't have the airplanes and it's always been that way until the recent change. So keep telling them they have no right to complain. That should really piss them off.
240, the brief article summary includes:
First paragraph, third sentence. "The Federal Aviation Administration is redrawing the paths flights follow as it switches from ground-based to satellite navigation dubbed NextGen. ..."
Second paragraph, last sentence... "Ms. McAuliffe (resident of Los Gatos) says, 'The FAA says there was no significant impact and I don’t know how they could think that.'"
We're still waiting for that final report from Councilmember Digre, which would likely read: "We can do nothing, but the talk makes you feel better, and may bring us (Digre and Keener) votes".
And, IF the airplane flight path noise abatement "memo" has not been sent from our City to the County (and other Agencies) previously-- that might be an item worth introducing to the City Council Agenda.
(Go for it City Council NIMBIES, Digre and Keener, something positive from you without a fatal glitch. Some of us can hardly wait.)
The NIMBIES of Park Pacifica want the plans to go away. Wah! Why not ban cars while you're at it?
Typical NIMBY crybabies.
You buy or rent a house near an airport (all of Pacifica fits that description-remember all those UAL employees and retirees living here) and you can expect to be under the flight paths at one time or another. SFO predates probably everything in Pacifica except Sam's Castle. Certainly Park Pacifica and Linda Mar. Airports grow just like traffic on Highway One. Flight paths change for many reasons...fuel, safety, more flights, public outcry. You don't like it in or over your backyard? Well, pilgrim, you're a not-in-my-back-yard NIMBY! How those shoes fit?
The FAA probably has a dart board with towns surrounding SFO. Every so often they toss a dart and some other town gets the treatment. Inevitable part of living here.
So Jim Wagner is now a NIMBY?
11:58-- if the shoe fits...
Wags is gung ho about widening the highway, increasing the noise for the surrounding neighborhoods. Anyone opposed to the widening is a NIMBY.
But the FAA makes some minor route chnages to save all flyers time and money and all of a sudden he and his fellow Park Pacificans go full on NIMBY and call Jackie Spier for help. WAH!
Karma's a bitch, ain't it?
Fairmont, Edgemar, and Manor all have to provide a noise disclosure to a buyer when the sell a home. I guess that has to extend to south Pacifica as well. Wonder what that does to values.
1007 Yes, he is. Although that news will probably be met with either stony silence or convoluted claims of special circumstance--or both, it's true. No shame in it. Just part of being human. Being a NIMBY is situational and we all have situations which bring out our inner NIMBY. We all have things we care about and would fight for. That's a good thing as long as we leave the hypocrisy out of it.
It's only NIMBYism if someone you don't like is doing it; otherwise it's simply "looking out for your own interests."
To paraphrase the moderator of this fine blog: the overhead flight path is an international corridor in need of improvement and NIMBIES want to block the much-needed progress of our airlines.
Hey, just think of it as a highway in the sky. No more problem, right? Good for us, right? Well, not good for you maybe, but good for me. See?
We are all NIMBIES about one thing or another. That's actually what keeps the ball rolling in a democracy.
A NOBY is a different thing altogether. It's the NOBIES who have broken Pacifica. They are against everything and anything that might improve Pacifica for fear that it will bring in "outsiders".
1126, 1133, the NIMBIES of this City have been blocking needed City progress and crippling the economy of this City for 30+ years.
That is a quite different issue than the invasion of airplane noise which bothers certain neighborhoods in this City, and seems to be a common complain in certain areas throughout the USA.
102, what are you saying is the NOBY acronym stands for?
102 You mean like airplanes? They bring in outsiders, don't they? Sooo, if you have issues with the flight paths and all those outsiders, you're what? A Republican Presidential Candidate? Wagner's a NIMBY on this issue with no less self-interest than any one else called NIMBY on here and shuffling your acronyms won't change that.
The NOBIES say no to everything. NO to highway alternatives. NO to rent stabilization. NO to a just cause eviction ordinance. NO to airplanes saving time and fuel.
The NOBY NIMBIES of Park Pacifica want the whole world to fly around them so that they don't ever have to hear a single airplane. Maybe they shoulda thought about it when they moved within 5 miles of an airport!
Better yet, turn Oddstadt into a four lane highway going up over the hill into San Bruno and listen to the Park Pacifica NIMBIES and realtors squawk about their world ending!
lemme see if i've got this straight...
if i oppose widening the highway, i'm a nimby
BUT
if i oppose planes flying over my back yard, i'm not a nimby
we should support widening the highway in the name of progress, saving time, gas, etc
BUT
we should oppose planes flying overhead in the name of progress, saving time, gas, etc.
does that about sum it all up?
All of you purposeful idiots know that conflating airplane noise over a city with development on the ground in the city are two entirely different things.
Quite being stupid would you.
A 747,a week ago,came over Fairmont,like it was ready to land on the street.It's only a matter of time until one crashes like we see on the news.
You don't want planes flying over YOIR backyard -- they should fly over someone ELSE'S backyard, but you're not a NIMBY. Nosiree. Uh-huh, yeah, got it.
740 No one cares about Fairmont. Don't care if the planes are so close you can see the in-flight programs. Don't conflate your safety and genuine long-standing noise issues with property values in Park Pacifica. None of that conflating, ok?
829 The Great Pogo said, "We have met the enemy and he is us". Sure miss Pogo. He regularly skewered hypocrits. He'd have a field day with this bunch.
8:49- I know no one cares about Fairmont airplane noise! But now ,I am amazed ,people all over have to put up with it, also.Misery likes company.
When I say that I don't want airplane noise in my backyard, don't conflate it with your not wanting a highway widened in your backyard. Totally different issues -- one involves a plane; the other, a car. Totally, totally different! In fact, the two things couldn't be more different from each other.
Aha! I've finally figured it out.
If you complain about something, but you're not a realtor, you're a NIMBY.
If you're a realtor and complain about something, you're a concerned citizen looking out for what's best for the community.
God bless our selfless realtors!
Let's add more flight paths so more planes can fly over us and get to where they're going faster. That will solve the air traffic congestion problem.
If you're complaining about the noise of a plane flying over your backyard, you're the literal definition of a Not In My Back Yard card-carrying NIMBY. Sorry if people pointing this out to you pisses you off, but them's the facts.
Perhaps now you'll have a smidgen more compassion for people in similar situations and won't rush to tar and feather them as NIMBIES like it's a bad word, since you yourself are one.
Sue Digre is Pacifica's representative on the Airport Roundtable and she is arguing for noise reduction. Now does that solidify her as a bona-fide nimby as has been suspected or an advocate for Pacifica, and a friend of the real estate community, or what!? The world is topsy turvey
If you have aligned yourself with Fred Howard and his buddies you are also part of the problem. He is the main leader of the hippies, nimby's and noby's back 30 plus years ago.
Sue tries to help but poor Sue couldn't light a fire with matches and gasoline!
Digre is arguing for noise reduction. That's a laugh. We don't stand a chance. First of all she won't be able to make a cogent argument.
Secondly Pacifica is the bay area joke for incompetence.
I'm surprised that Lancelle and deJarnutt haven't recommended Sue to chair the committee to find the "missing" $4,500,000.
That would assure that they will get away with it.
LMAO. Realtors and such under fire! Wondered how long til the diversion would be launched. Go to Sue Digre! Toss in Julie, Pete and the missing money. 1139 you are Pavlovian! On airport noise issue, Digre is aligned with Jackie Speier, previously with Lantos, and various other local and regional officials and has been for some time. No results yet? Well, maybe not for precious Park Pacifica, but the issue is as old as the airport and so is the continual effort. It's continual because the problem is always going to be there and improvement is temporary and comes in, oh yes, it comes in degrees. So, ya wanna blame Digre? Go right ahead. She's in real good company. BTW, those of you out of the closet and new to the NIMBY fold, and you know who you are, don't be trashing other NIMBIES lest you be mistaken for a boorish, greedy, impotent Republican or the local version of same.
1024 So you say, but she seems to light your fire on a regular basis. Awwwwww.
12:42
Get a life.
NOBIES in this town are first cousins with the children in the Tea Party.
They don't know how to handle responsibility so they just insist on the easiest option ......NO! (tantrum, tantrum, tantrum)
^^^
Usual confused Gang of No, NIMBY comments, equating airport noise pollution with a City that has neither a balance City economy, nor a sustainable City infrastructure-- thanks to extreme NIMBY manipulation.
And how's that campaign against have a City at all going? You know, "live in our neighbors", let the homeowners and County pick-up our default debt, let the County determine the future of our resulting several scattered townships. Wait for the 100 year flood, then evacuate.
NIMBY = Not In My Back Yard
Airplane noise? Not in my back yard!
Stop the extreme twisted NIMBY manipulation. Let the planes fly over Pacifica so everyone can save time and money when flying and stop blocking progress. The FAA are the experts -- leave it to them and stop trying to second guess them.
No government agency should be left unsupervised by the public it regulates. Trust but verify.
High Five 311! The Truth. And no amount of conflating, diverting or hissy fits can change it.
Love the sarcasm 316. It's just a highway in the sky.
ESHOO, FARR, SPEIER RELEASE FAA RESPONSE TO CONGRESSIONAL INQUIRIES ABOUT AIRCRAFT NOISE
WASHINGTON, D.C.—Reps. Anna G. Eshoo (CA-18), Sam Farr (CA-20) and Jackie Speier (CA-14) have received and released to the public the FAA Initiative to Address Noise Concerns that the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) has authored to address the unprecedented constituent complaints about noise from air traffic above San Francisco, San Mateo, Santa Cruz and Santa Clara Counties.
Eshoo: “My colleagues and I have worked tirelessly to engage the FAA's leadership to take concrete steps to mitigate and address the noise from aircraft in our respective congressional districts. As a result of our collaboration, FAA Administrator Michael Huerta and FAA Regional Director Glen Martin met with local elected officials, community groups and individuals from our congressional districts to discuss the impacts of NextGen and additional issues prior to its implementation, including Surf Air at the San Carlos Airport.
“I welcome this important first step the FAA has developed. The FAA leadership will follow up with community meetings, coordinated through our offices, to explain in detail the FAA's plan to address the noise problems being experienced in our region.”
Farr: “This plan of action is evidence the FAA is willing to consider the changes proposed by the community. For months, the commercial aircraft noise in Santa Cruz and the surrounding area has been terrible. From the beginning, I have told the FAA that they created this mess so it is up to them to fix it.
“This is only a first step but it is a good one. It shows everyone is committed to developing some real solutions. I hope the FAA will continue to listen to the communities it serves and work with them to solve any problems that arise from the switch to the NextGen flight plan.”
Speier: “My constituents have long been impacted by noise caused by aircraft operating at SFO and more recently at San Carlos and Half Moon Bay Airports. The FAA's Initiative to Address Noise Concerns is a compilation of the ideas that were offered by the public regarding SFO at the FAA's recent meetings in our three congressional districts, as well as requests made by the SFO Airport Community Roundtable. Some of these ideas may be deemed workable by the FAA and some may not.
“However, having previously been resistant to taking community suggestions, the FAA, for the first time in many years, has committed to studying ideas submitted by the affected communities. I am gratified that the FAA is rolling up its sleeves to come up with solutions. The health of those who live under constant bombardment of airplane noise is being seriously compromised and the FAA has a responsibility to take action to address it.”
Politician says anything for your vote
The stoner says your his best friend, just to take another toke.
The drunk loves you for another swig of wine.
1029 Sounds like progress. At least the FAA is listening "for the first time in many years" as Congresswoman Speier says. Thank you SFO Airport Community Roundtable and member Sue Digre for community outreach and keeping up the pressure for years.
724 Sounds autobiographical. Explains a lot.
10:33
Shouldn't you be sitting on the porch waiting for the postman?
Stegink is such a glory hound. The original post came from a group in the South Bay that has been working to mitigate the noise of the approaching planes. That post has been around for days. He's taking credit for "breaking news". I think he's done that before. Who is this guy?
Dan Stegink from Linda Mar North 1d ago
... and seconds later comes the press release straight from Representative Speier's office...:
ESHOO, FARR, SPEIER RELEASE FAA RESPONSE TO CONGRESSIONAL INQUIRIES ABOUT AIRCRAFT NOISE
WASHINGTON, … View more
Oh jeez, not another glory hound.
I admit it. I'm a NIMASS (Not In My Air Space Stupid). That applies to anything that flies, including hang gliders and meth heads.
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